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Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.03 20:01:00 -
[1]
These are excellent graphs. However, you should really take ship bonuses into account. For example, when looking at battleships, I have found it best to examine the Armageddon vs the Megathron. They fulfill essentially the same role, and you can (as a bonus) ignore drone DPS.
The Abaddon is also an interesting case (IMO), but it's not as easy to ignore drone DPS. The graphs can be offset by drone DPS if you like.
It's worth noting that you should pick a standard ship to shoot at - such as Raven/Drake/Cerb/Crow or something. Sig res = sig rad isn't particularly useful since the ships have different sig radiuses.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.03 20:27:00 -
[2]
Originally by: VanNostrum -gallente ships have superior drone bays/bonuses
I remind you of the Arbitrator line of ships, and the Armageddon
Quote: -gallente ships have higher total ehp
I remind you of the resist bonus vs rep bonus.
Quote: -gallente ships have better bonuses
Not really?
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.05 18:12:00 -
[3]
****, another blaster thread about to go down the drain to trolling NMX (tee-hee, now the question is whether NMX is the troller or the trollee... and I'm not about to read enough context to find out).
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.05 18:48:00 -
[4]
Originally by: The Djego The ability to read properly is a amazing gift, isnŠt it. Hint, there is allready a advantage in DPS, so the number it is not a request for a 50% damage boost, even if it isnŠt this obvious for special people like you.
Well, it kinda is asking for a 50% damage boost, since the geddon deals so much damage. ;-)
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.05 19:13:00 -
[5]
Originally by: The Djego
DPS unbonused, no damage mods, high damage short range amno, without skills: Neutron Cannon II: 30 Mega Puls II: 22
Correct number for matching the request:
33 -> 10% actualy.
At least this is how I read it.
Yeah, I was being facetious a bit there. Because I'm lazy, what's the final DPS number you're looking at from a 3 MFS Blasterthron (exclude drones)?
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.05 19:41:00 -
[6]
Originally by: The Djego
Made a small mistake the right number is 29(had still a damage rig on my Mega, should start up with clean fits for EFT whoring ).
From 29 -> 33 this would be a 13.8% DPS increase. That gives a Neutron Mega(3 damage mods) a DPS of around 1064 DPS(compared to the 935 atm) and ends up to be around 1381 DPS instead of the current 1252(129 DPS gain).
Uuuummmm, that's pretty reasonable.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.05 23:03:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Liang Nuren on 05/10/2009 23:04:04
Originally by: TigerWoman @ etho the graphs say that megas are equal or better dps till 13km even in small transversal, the null vs an multi comparision shows that null can compete up to 25km.
all that with better tracking less cap use.
That sounds roughly correct until you take ship bonuses into account. IIRC, if you include falloff hit degradation, turnover is at 11-12km, but if you include ship bonuses turnover becomes ~8km.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
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Posted - 2009.10.05 23:40:00 -
[8]
Originally by: TigerWoman @liang
turnover is at 8km under combat situations you said under realistic situations. where do you see the turnover to be fair enough? short range high dmg ammo for amarr is like 15km with less tracking then blasters of course and more cap use and less ability to dictate range and with worse cap when it comes to longer engagements.
You make it sound like you don't have the choice to engage from 50km. I'd say it's utterly inexcusable for damage turnover to happen before 13km (which means that the target is unwebbed for both aggressors). I would also encourage you to examine the Rokh - where should damage turnover be for the Rokh?
Quote: under theses circumstances at which distance do you thin amarr supremacy should start? by that try to take into consideration that amarr is the least versatile and one of the lest mobile races in the game.
It's funny that you should think range versatility isn't versatility in some way. I'll take this moment to argue that Gallente is less versatile because they really are one trick ponies - get in your face and melt you.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation War.Pigs.
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Posted - 2009.10.25 17:52:00 -
[9]
Originally by: NightmareX I rather say the Megathron does a fantastic job here when you compare it to a tier 3 ship with 25% more resists than the Mega.
The Mega does passably, but only if you assume you are shooting armor tanked battleships that magically start in your optimal. The Abaddon can be set up to get blaster tracking + damage and *STILL* have more HP, and it can be set up to deal fantastic damage at range.
The only reason it's not WTFBBQOP is because of cap issues... which are largely mitigated by cap boosters.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation War.Pigs.
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Posted - 2009.10.26 20:09:00 -
[10]
Can you two get a room instead of ruining a mildly informative topic?
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
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Liang Nuren
No Salvation War.Pigs.
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Posted - 2009.10.26 20:18:00 -
[11]
Your opinions are welcome - both of you. But your constant flaming is utterly ******ed. Besides, NMX has changed his tune to be much more reasonable regarding blasters. Where traditionally he's insisted that they are the end-all be-all of PVP combat, we see that he now is putting more emphasis on range. I think we can all agree that when Dominion rolls around, blasters may need some examining.
But, then again, maybe they won't. The TC/TE buff is probably more beneficial to my blaster ships than my AC ships, so I'm really looking forward to seeing how that turns out for blasters before I go saying that blasters need some really huge buff.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation War.Pigs.
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Posted - 2009.10.26 22:12:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Lilith Velkor
Well to be fair, I've seen quite a few people resort to faction and deadspace mods, but thats more because they need to work around the extremely tight fitting on a RR Mega, i.e. regain some lost effectiveness rather than improve in the first place.
The 6 cpu you can save on the AN EANM are kind of a big deal actually depending on the fit, and the little extra EHP isnt horrible either.
IIRC C-Type ANPs do roughly the same job as an EANM II and save thirty CPU over a AN EANM... ;-)
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Liang Nuren
No Salvation War.Pigs.
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Posted - 2009.10.27 16:44:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Vyktor Abyss I get what you're saying Gabrial with regards the perspective in that a 300m long ship 1m away from you should be unmissable with a gun, but the reality of trying to mathmatically code this part into the tracking formula would be a nightmare for even the best mathmatician.
The additional radians taken up by an object at close range would also depend on the "frontage" aspect of what direction it is facing since a 5km long needle face on will have a different "frontage" to a 5km diameter sphere at the same distance.
Claims like "fix the formula" to include this stuff are unfeasible if you ask me, especially since they you're talking about model "frontage", which software isn't inherantly clever enough yet to incorporate. We're all flying spheres even though they dont look like it until the model design software improves.
If you propose a new forumla to CCP that works better than the current one taking into account the "perspective" radians at close range then I'm sure they'd consider it. So dust off your Trigonometry books and get cracking.
It's been done before... and it wasn't terribly hard.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
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